<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Back From Barcelona</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.urbanophile.com/2009/11/24/back-from-barcelona/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2009/11/24/back-from-barcelona/</link>
	<description>Passionate About Cities</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 12 Mar 2010 13:44:20 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.1</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: Alon Levy</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2009/11/24/back-from-barcelona/comment-page-1/#comment-6129</link>
		<dc:creator>Alon Levy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Dec 2009 00:05:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=1083#comment-6129</guid>
		<description>The tropical climate in Singapore promotes mall-oriented development. But malls can still be laid in a walkable manner - for example, they&#039;re fairly walkable in Singapore&#039;s CBD and on Orchard Road (they&#039;re also walkable in the central parts of Shanghai). In Singapore it&#039;s common for young people to walk around from mall to mall - sometimes out in the hot air.

In Tel Aviv, which is just as hot in the summer, this is common as well, in the more walkable parts of town. Some streets - e.g. Sheinkin, Basel, Dizengoff - have even managed to preserve walkable old urbanism.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The tropical climate in Singapore promotes mall-oriented development. But malls can still be laid in a walkable manner &#8211; for example, they&#8217;re fairly walkable in Singapore&#8217;s CBD and on Orchard Road (they&#8217;re also walkable in the central parts of Shanghai). In Singapore it&#8217;s common for young people to walk around from mall to mall &#8211; sometimes out in the hot air.</p>
<p>In Tel Aviv, which is just as hot in the summer, this is common as well, in the more walkable parts of town. Some streets &#8211; e.g. Sheinkin, Basel, Dizengoff &#8211; have even managed to preserve walkable old urbanism.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: The Urbanophile</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2009/11/24/back-from-barcelona/comment-page-1/#comment-6128</link>
		<dc:creator>The Urbanophile</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Dec 2009 23:47:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=1083#comment-6128</guid>
		<description>It wouldn&#039;t matter if Singapore had a more walkable built form since the tropical climate makes walking more than a short distance outdoors unpleasant. It&#039;s hot and humid almost every day, with frequent rain.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It wouldn&#8217;t matter if Singapore had a more walkable built form since the tropical climate makes walking more than a short distance outdoors unpleasant. It&#8217;s hot and humid almost every day, with frequent rain.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Alon Levy</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2009/11/24/back-from-barcelona/comment-page-1/#comment-6127</link>
		<dc:creator>Alon Levy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Dec 2009 23:43:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=1083#comment-6127</guid>
		<description>In Moscow and Singapore, the metro is configured for high speed and high station spacing, with bus rides at both ends of the trip. I don&#039;t know about Moscow, but Singapore is definitely not walkable: if you look at its street network on Google Maps, it will look like a typical suburban cul-de-sac-ridden map, rather than like a dense city grid.

It&#039;s not how Barcelona&#039;s subway is configured - for a start, the average interstation in Barcelona is less than half that in Singapore and Moscow. And it&#039;s telling that the Singaporean/Muscovite way of building subways evolved in an environment of strict controls on car ownership, both in the Soviet Union and in modern Singapore. But it&#039;s one way of building subways.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In Moscow and Singapore, the metro is configured for high speed and high station spacing, with bus rides at both ends of the trip. I don&#8217;t know about Moscow, but Singapore is definitely not walkable: if you look at its street network on Google Maps, it will look like a typical suburban cul-de-sac-ridden map, rather than like a dense city grid.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s not how Barcelona&#8217;s subway is configured &#8211; for a start, the average interstation in Barcelona is less than half that in Singapore and Moscow. And it&#8217;s telling that the Singaporean/Muscovite way of building subways evolved in an environment of strict controls on car ownership, both in the Soviet Union and in modern Singapore. But it&#8217;s one way of building subways.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: cdc guy</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2009/11/24/back-from-barcelona/comment-page-1/#comment-6126</link>
		<dc:creator>cdc guy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Dec 2009 23:14:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=1083#comment-6126</guid>
		<description>Aargh.  Grammar check on post 15:  &quot;...walks to the front door from parking ARE usually measured in feet.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Aargh.  Grammar check on post 15:  &#8220;&#8230;walks to the front door from parking ARE usually measured in feet.&#8221;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: cdc guy</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2009/11/24/back-from-barcelona/comment-page-1/#comment-6125</link>
		<dc:creator>cdc guy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Dec 2009 23:13:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=1083#comment-6125</guid>
		<description>Terranaut, probably a &quot;web&quot; model, which is a mesh with non-parallel radials to/from the center, is the appropriate conceptual design for most US cities.  

This is appropriate as their CBDs hold jobs (i.e. actual number of jobs is steady or grows more slowly than the outlying districts), but lose relative share of jobs to the suburbs/exurbs.  Thus, a web:  multiple crosstown linkages across the radials enable commutes that do not involve the central node.

Alas, such a distributed system has a price:  the whole metro would have to be far more walkable or bikable, so that people could make 5-10 minute walks at each end of their commute.  This is anathema in a nation where walks to the front door from parking is usually measured in feet.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Terranaut, probably a &#8220;web&#8221; model, which is a mesh with non-parallel radials to/from the center, is the appropriate conceptual design for most US cities.  </p>
<p>This is appropriate as their CBDs hold jobs (i.e. actual number of jobs is steady or grows more slowly than the outlying districts), but lose relative share of jobs to the suburbs/exurbs.  Thus, a web:  multiple crosstown linkages across the radials enable commutes that do not involve the central node.</p>
<p>Alas, such a distributed system has a price:  the whole metro would have to be far more walkable or bikable, so that people could make 5-10 minute walks at each end of their commute.  This is anathema in a nation where walks to the front door from parking is usually measured in feet.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: The Urbanophile</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2009/11/24/back-from-barcelona/comment-page-1/#comment-6122</link>
		<dc:creator>The Urbanophile</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Dec 2009 21:27:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=1083#comment-6122</guid>
		<description>michelle, thanks for chiming in!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>michelle, thanks for chiming in!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: michelle</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2009/11/24/back-from-barcelona/comment-page-1/#comment-6119</link>
		<dc:creator>michelle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Dec 2009 19:35:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=1083#comment-6119</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m posting a little late, but just wanted to say I loved this.  I spent 7 days in Barcelona in 2005 and you are right about many things - including the partying!  Thanks for featuring Sagrada Familia.  In my opinion it is a more impressive church than even St. Peter&#039;s in Rome.  

I&#039;m glad someone brought up the port city point, because that&#039;s what was going through my mind when I read of your comparisons of the two cities.  Another interesting comparison would be Barcelona-Rotterdam and/or Rotterdam to other cities in the Netherlands.

Also I just wanted to say that the Art Deco buildings in Chicago are some of my favorite architecture there.  I believe it&#039;s the Carson Pirie Scott building, with the amazing arch over the door??</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m posting a little late, but just wanted to say I loved this.  I spent 7 days in Barcelona in 2005 and you are right about many things &#8211; including the partying!  Thanks for featuring Sagrada Familia.  In my opinion it is a more impressive church than even St. Peter&#8217;s in Rome.  </p>
<p>I&#8217;m glad someone brought up the port city point, because that&#8217;s what was going through my mind when I read of your comparisons of the two cities.  Another interesting comparison would be Barcelona-Rotterdam and/or Rotterdam to other cities in the Netherlands.</p>
<p>Also I just wanted to say that the Art Deco buildings in Chicago are some of my favorite architecture there.  I believe it&#8217;s the Carson Pirie Scott building, with the amazing arch over the door??</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: terranaut</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2009/11/24/back-from-barcelona/comment-page-1/#comment-6021</link>
		<dc:creator>terranaut</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Nov 2009 05:23:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=1083#comment-6021</guid>
		<description>I was interested in your comment about Barcelona&#039;s metro system being a &quot;mesh-like structure that serves most of the city.&quot;  Do you think that American cities, and especially those now looking at new light rail systems, can learn anything from this layout?  Most of the systems I&#039;ve seen have been a hub-and-spoke system centered on downtown.  

In a place like my hometown of St. Louis, I wonder how much sense this makes with downtown continuing to decline in importance with respect to jobs relative to the rest of the region.  Are we building transportation systems based on a 19th/early 20th century idea of the American city?  Namely workers commuting into a &quot;downtown&quot; core where most of the jobs are located?  With jobs continuing to migrate out of downtown despite a highway system centered on it, how much sense does it make to invest in fixed infrastructure centered on this particular part of the metro area?

In short, are we too fixated on an antiquated, 19th century view of the American city, which looking back may actually have been an anomaly with regard to commuting patterns and job concentration?  And is the future one of overall more density, but with jobs and destinations spread out more evenly, more like the Barcelona model?  Considering the resources invested in these systems, it seems rather important to have a clear idea of which direction our cities are heading.  Any thoughts from the author or other commenters would be welcome.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was interested in your comment about Barcelona&#8217;s metro system being a &#8220;mesh-like structure that serves most of the city.&#8221;  Do you think that American cities, and especially those now looking at new light rail systems, can learn anything from this layout?  Most of the systems I&#8217;ve seen have been a hub-and-spoke system centered on downtown.  </p>
<p>In a place like my hometown of St. Louis, I wonder how much sense this makes with downtown continuing to decline in importance with respect to jobs relative to the rest of the region.  Are we building transportation systems based on a 19th/early 20th century idea of the American city?  Namely workers commuting into a &#8220;downtown&#8221; core where most of the jobs are located?  With jobs continuing to migrate out of downtown despite a highway system centered on it, how much sense does it make to invest in fixed infrastructure centered on this particular part of the metro area?</p>
<p>In short, are we too fixated on an antiquated, 19th century view of the American city, which looking back may actually have been an anomaly with regard to commuting patterns and job concentration?  And is the future one of overall more density, but with jobs and destinations spread out more evenly, more like the Barcelona model?  Considering the resources invested in these systems, it seems rather important to have a clear idea of which direction our cities are heading.  Any thoughts from the author or other commenters would be welcome.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Peter Smith</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2009/11/24/back-from-barcelona/comment-page-1/#comment-5983</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter Smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Nov 2009 09:52:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=1083#comment-5983</guid>
		<description>great report!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>great report!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Like Living There</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2009/11/24/back-from-barcelona/comment-page-1/#comment-5978</link>
		<dc:creator>Like Living There</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Nov 2009 02:03:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=1083#comment-5978</guid>
		<description>Aaron,
Read your response to Harald and you are correct that it&#039;s impossible to appreciate the richness of Barcelona&#039;s history, architecture and culture in one short visit. Given all those qualities, we&#039;ve found that it&#039;s still a city with an unpretentious charm that has long since been superseded by smugness in other destinations. To experience that firsthand you must replace the tourist schedule with a sense of living there, even for a short time. If you haven&#039;t tried it, next time rent an apartment (pick the neighborhood as well as the property) and go with the local flow.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Aaron,<br />
Read your response to Harald and you are correct that it&#8217;s impossible to appreciate the richness of Barcelona&#8217;s history, architecture and culture in one short visit. Given all those qualities, we&#8217;ve found that it&#8217;s still a city with an unpretentious charm that has long since been superseded by smugness in other destinations. To experience that firsthand you must replace the tourist schedule with a sense of living there, even for a short time. If you haven&#8217;t tried it, next time rent an apartment (pick the neighborhood as well as the property) and go with the local flow.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
