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	<title>Comments on: Replay: The Giant Sucking Sound</title>
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	<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2010/01/08/replay-the-giant-sucking-sound/</link>
	<description>Passionate About Cities</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 10 Sep 2010 09:01:13 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: The Urbanophile</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2010/01/08/replay-the-giant-sucking-sound/comment-page-1/#comment-6943</link>
		<dc:creator>The Urbanophile</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 Jan 2010 13:12:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=2042#comment-6943</guid>
		<description>Alon, it has been on my list to upgrade spam filtering. Right now I don&#039;t have a good development environment set up, however, so I&#039;m loathe to install plugins until I have someplace to really test them out.

In the meantime, I try to delete them as quickly as possible. I also added a couple of terms to the blacklist, so we&#039;ll see if that helps at all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alon, it has been on my list to upgrade spam filtering. Right now I don&#8217;t have a good development environment set up, however, so I&#8217;m loathe to install plugins until I have someplace to really test them out.</p>
<p>In the meantime, I try to delete them as quickly as possible. I also added a couple of terms to the blacklist, so we&#8217;ll see if that helps at all.</p>
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		<title>By: Alon Levy</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2010/01/08/replay-the-giant-sucking-sound/comment-page-1/#comment-6897</link>
		<dc:creator>Alon Levy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jan 2010 12:11:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=2042#comment-6897</guid>
		<description>You need a better spam filter.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You need a better spam filter.</p>
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		<title>By: Alon Levy</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2010/01/08/replay-the-giant-sucking-sound/comment-page-1/#comment-6721</link>
		<dc:creator>Alon Levy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Jan 2010 17:34:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=2042#comment-6721</guid>
		<description>Eric: yes, Austin would almost certainly do a lot to help your Mex-Aussie cousins. However, it&#039;s in line with the emphasis on equality in education given in the studies referenced in my link. Texas has one of the smallest racial education gaps of any US state.

(By the way, the Jacobs video contains good ideas, but there are two problems there. First, Jacobs claims that rich preserves turn boring and often decay, unless they are very small. In fact, the opposite is true: rich areas, such as the Upper East Side of Manhattan, can remain rich even as all other neighborhoods around them decay. Second, her emphasis on home ownership is ill-conceived, and even includes the wrong statement that the US has the highest home ownership in the world.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Eric: yes, Austin would almost certainly do a lot to help your Mex-Aussie cousins. However, it&#8217;s in line with the emphasis on equality in education given in the studies referenced in my link. Texas has one of the smallest racial education gaps of any US state.</p>
<p>(By the way, the Jacobs video contains good ideas, but there are two problems there. First, Jacobs claims that rich preserves turn boring and often decay, unless they are very small. In fact, the opposite is true: rich areas, such as the Upper East Side of Manhattan, can remain rich even as all other neighborhoods around them decay. Second, her emphasis on home ownership is ill-conceived, and even includes the wrong statement that the US has the highest home ownership in the world.)</p>
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		<title>By: Eric</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2010/01/08/replay-the-giant-sucking-sound/comment-page-1/#comment-6719</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Jan 2010 14:26:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=2042#comment-6719</guid>
		<description>Alon: interesting point about American vs. Australian mobility.  My Mex-Aussie cousins might be benefiting from stronger social benefits, but I&#039;m not sure that their successful careers would have been hampered much had my aunts come to America instead.  Many American cities have great advantages for immigrants.  It depends largely in where you live.  Austin, TX did a lot for my immigrant family. 

I believe improving the social mobility of immigrants is easy and it is something cities can consciously choose to do better than any other agency, if they can come up with ways to circumvent their own bureaucratic hurdles and allow immigrants to implement the untapped benefits of their cultural intelligence.  In her Scully Prize acceptance speech, Jane Jacobs touched on this possibility for cities: http://tcstreetsforpeople.org/node/1025</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alon: interesting point about American vs. Australian mobility.  My Mex-Aussie cousins might be benefiting from stronger social benefits, but I&#8217;m not sure that their successful careers would have been hampered much had my aunts come to America instead.  Many American cities have great advantages for immigrants.  It depends largely in where you live.  Austin, TX did a lot for my immigrant family. </p>
<p>I believe improving the social mobility of immigrants is easy and it is something cities can consciously choose to do better than any other agency, if they can come up with ways to circumvent their own bureaucratic hurdles and allow immigrants to implement the untapped benefits of their cultural intelligence.  In her Scully Prize acceptance speech, Jane Jacobs touched on this possibility for cities: <a href="http://tcstreetsforpeople.org/node/1025" rel="nofollow">http://tcstreetsforpeople.org/node/1025</a></p>
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		<title>By: Alon Levy</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2010/01/08/replay-the-giant-sucking-sound/comment-page-1/#comment-6714</link>
		<dc:creator>Alon Levy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Jan 2010 03:34:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=2042#comment-6714</guid>
		<description>Patrick, your link is correct, but to get from it to the peer-reviewed study you need to follow multiple links - from Yglesias&#039;s blog to CAP, which only references the peer-reviewed study without linking to it.

Full disclosure: I linked to the CAP study on my blog, more than 3 years ago, before I realized just how shoddy CAP is. You can find a compendium of the peer-reviewed studies &lt;a href=&quot;http://inside.org.au/american-dreams/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt; along with links - no need for filtering through ideologically motivated thinktanks.

One of the interesting facts stated in the link above is a comparison of immigrant children&#039;s performance in the US, a low-mobility country, and Australia, a high-mobility country. Even controlling for parental education levels, it claims, US immigrant-born children lag behind their counterparts in Australia.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Patrick, your link is correct, but to get from it to the peer-reviewed study you need to follow multiple links &#8211; from Yglesias&#8217;s blog to CAP, which only references the peer-reviewed study without linking to it.</p>
<p>Full disclosure: I linked to the CAP study on my blog, more than 3 years ago, before I realized just how shoddy CAP is. You can find a compendium of the peer-reviewed studies <a href="http://inside.org.au/american-dreams/" rel="nofollow">here</a> along with links &#8211; no need for filtering through ideologically motivated thinktanks.</p>
<p>One of the interesting facts stated in the link above is a comparison of immigrant children&#8217;s performance in the US, a low-mobility country, and Australia, a high-mobility country. Even controlling for parental education levels, it claims, US immigrant-born children lag behind their counterparts in Australia.</p>
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		<title>By: Patrick (G)</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2010/01/08/replay-the-giant-sucking-sound/comment-page-1/#comment-6711</link>
		<dc:creator>Patrick (G)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Jan 2010 00:47:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=2042#comment-6711</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m not sure that your point about Germany and entrepreneurial energy vs. U.S. is entirely true.  

To my mind, &quot;entrepreneurial energy&quot; is a means to an end: &quot;social mobility&quot;, and if you look at &quot;social mobility&quot;, the German model seems to work better than the U.S. model. (see Link)

Which shouldn&#039;t surprise; there might be more entrepreneurial energy in the U.S., but the risks are higher, and that translates into a lower success rate for social mobility.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not sure that your point about Germany and entrepreneurial energy vs. U.S. is entirely true.  </p>
<p>To my mind, &#8220;entrepreneurial energy&#8221; is a means to an end: &#8220;social mobility&#8221;, and if you look at &#8220;social mobility&#8221;, the German model seems to work better than the U.S. model. (see Link)</p>
<p>Which shouldn&#8217;t surprise; there might be more entrepreneurial energy in the U.S., but the risks are higher, and that translates into a lower success rate for social mobility.</p>
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		<title>By: Michelle</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2010/01/08/replay-the-giant-sucking-sound/comment-page-1/#comment-6701</link>
		<dc:creator>Michelle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jan 2010 10:08:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=2042#comment-6701</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the feedback guys. It is refreshing to find an intelligent site with an interesting topic. I hope to learn more here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the feedback guys. It is refreshing to find an intelligent site with an interesting topic. I hope to learn more here.</p>
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		<title>By: The Urbanophile</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2010/01/08/replay-the-giant-sucking-sound/comment-page-1/#comment-6695</link>
		<dc:creator>The Urbanophile</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jan 2010 02:44:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=2042#comment-6695</guid>
		<description>Michelle, please feel welcome to post anything you&#039;d like, as long as it is on topic. I welcome discussion and disagreement and different points of view on all topics. Your participation is appreciated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Michelle, please feel welcome to post anything you&#8217;d like, as long as it is on topic. I welcome discussion and disagreement and different points of view on all topics. Your participation is appreciated.</p>
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		<title>By: Wad</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2010/01/08/replay-the-giant-sucking-sound/comment-page-1/#comment-6693</link>
		<dc:creator>Wad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Jan 2010 23:18:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=2042#comment-6693</guid>
		<description>Michelle, I never meant to discourage you from posting here. You&#039;re addressing the topic and help keep the coversation moving. You should feel welcome to post here. And please stick around.

Urbanophile is one of the best urbanist sites on the Web.

My primary quibble with sustainability is the feedback problem. Humans, when they find a good or process that is sustainable, become dependent on sustainability.

All natural resources are finite. What happens when there is a disruption to or exhaustion of those resources? A crisis occurs, and it&#039;s coupled with the problem of humans&#039; economic and social position tied to the leverage of those resources. Laborers don&#039;t want to be obsolete, and elites have sunk capital that can&#039;t be recovered.

Humans are hard-wired to gravitate to stasis, despite our assertions to the contrary. When we seek sustainability, we tend to expect it. That&#039;s the problem.

Another person who addresses this is Nassim Taleb in \The Black Swan.\ It deals with mathematical improbability and randomness, but Taleb&#039;s applications are far-reaching into most physical and social sciences.

So we don&#039;t just have to worry about natural resources. Even more complex societies deal with the sustainability dilemma. Look at the sciences, as well. The scientific method is premised that nothing is certain and all theories must be open to be falsified in the future. Yet vanguard theories often produce schisms within their fields.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Michelle, I never meant to discourage you from posting here. You&#8217;re addressing the topic and help keep the coversation moving. You should feel welcome to post here. And please stick around.</p>
<p>Urbanophile is one of the best urbanist sites on the Web.</p>
<p>My primary quibble with sustainability is the feedback problem. Humans, when they find a good or process that is sustainable, become dependent on sustainability.</p>
<p>All natural resources are finite. What happens when there is a disruption to or exhaustion of those resources? A crisis occurs, and it&#8217;s coupled with the problem of humans&#8217; economic and social position tied to the leverage of those resources. Laborers don&#8217;t want to be obsolete, and elites have sunk capital that can&#8217;t be recovered.</p>
<p>Humans are hard-wired to gravitate to stasis, despite our assertions to the contrary. When we seek sustainability, we tend to expect it. That&#8217;s the problem.</p>
<p>Another person who addresses this is Nassim Taleb in \The Black Swan.\ It deals with mathematical improbability and randomness, but Taleb&#8217;s applications are far-reaching into most physical and social sciences.</p>
<p>So we don&#8217;t just have to worry about natural resources. Even more complex societies deal with the sustainability dilemma. Look at the sciences, as well. The scientific method is premised that nothing is certain and all theories must be open to be falsified in the future. Yet vanguard theories often produce schisms within their fields.</p>
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		<title>By: Michelle</title>
		<link>http://www.urbanophile.com/2010/01/08/replay-the-giant-sucking-sound/comment-page-1/#comment-6691</link>
		<dc:creator>Michelle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Jan 2010 22:31:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.urbanophile.com/?p=2042#comment-6691</guid>
		<description>Wad, guess we&#039;re getting bogged down in semantics here, but I have to disagree, sustainability is the capacity to endure, so I don&#039;t understand why that would be incompatible with creativity and our willingness to adapt. I know who Jane Jacobs is and although I don&#039;t come from what is technically known as the American midwest (I come from Picher, Oklahoma, a cursed &quot;supply region&quot; and have experienced first hand the economic, enviornmental, and social impacts of a city putting all its eggs in one basket) I find this a fascinating subject and am just here to learn. I apologize if I wasn&#039;t supposed to post here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wad, guess we&#8217;re getting bogged down in semantics here, but I have to disagree, sustainability is the capacity to endure, so I don&#8217;t understand why that would be incompatible with creativity and our willingness to adapt. I know who Jane Jacobs is and although I don&#8217;t come from what is technically known as the American midwest (I come from Picher, Oklahoma, a cursed &#8220;supply region&#8221; and have experienced first hand the economic, enviornmental, and social impacts of a city putting all its eggs in one basket) I find this a fascinating subject and am just here to learn. I apologize if I wasn&#8217;t supposed to post here.</p>
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